Comeau C++

QNX Newsgroups (Archives) qdn.public.qnxrtp.devtools
1

Has Comeau C++ been considered by the QNX team as an alternative C++ (and C99)
compiler? It only costs $50 a license (which I would be very happy to pay). Its
back end generates C code, and many ports to custom platforms, including
embedded ones, are already available. Existing ports to gcc on several platforms
should make the QNX port very easy (and cheap!)…

If executable sizes and speeds are good, then it might just be the solution for
the C++ developers annoyed by g++. It also happens to be, when combined with
the Dinkumware C and C++ Libraries, the most ISO compliant C++ compiler
available. It also has a large number of compatibility switches for compiling
older code.

Check out www.comeaucomputing.com

Tom

2

Thanks, I’ll take a look.

Tom <the_wid@my-deja.com> wrote:

Has Comeau C++ been considered by the QNX team as an alternative C++ (and C99)
compiler? It only costs $50 a license (which I would be very happy to pay). Its
back end generates C code, and many ports to custom platforms, including
embedded ones, are already available. Existing ports to gcc on several platforms
should make the QNX port very easy (and cheap!)…

If executable sizes and speeds are good, then it might just be the solution for
the C++ developers annoyed by g++. It also happens to be, when combined with
the Dinkumware C and C++ Libraries, the most ISO compliant C++ compiler
available. It also has a large number of compatibility switches for compiling
older code.

Check out > www.comeaucomputing.com

Tom

–
cburgess@qnx.com

3

Very interesting (if the statement about ISO compliance is true). I
would sure like to have a C++ compiler that could actually compile C++
code !

-----Original Message-----
From: Colin Burgess [mailto:cburgess@qnx.com]
Posted At: Friday, August 24, 2001 11:08 AM
Posted To: devtools
Conversation: Comeau C++
Subject: Re: Comeau C++


Thanks, I’ll take a look.

Tom <the_wid@my-deja.com> wrote:

Has Comeau C++ been considered by the QNX team as an alternative C++
(and C99)
compiler? It only costs $50 a license (which I would be very happy to
pay). Its
back end generates C code, and many ports to custom platforms,
including
embedded ones, are already available. Existing ports to gcc on several
platforms
should make the QNX port very easy (and cheap!)…

If executable sizes and speeds are good, then it might just be the
solution for
the C++ developers annoyed by g++. It also happens to be, when
combined with
the Dinkumware C and C++ Libraries, the most ISO compliant C++
compiler
available. It also has a large number of compatibility switches for
compiling
older code.

Check out > www.comeaucomputing.com

Tom

–
cburgess@qnx.com

4

Tom <the_wid@my-deja.com> wrote:

Has Comeau C++ been considered by the QNX team as an alternative C++ (and C99)
compiler? It only costs $50 a license (which I would be very happy to pay). Its
back end generates C code, and many ports to custom platforms, including
embedded ones, are already available. Existing ports to gcc on several platforms

It would we a very nice choice. I’ve already used the comeau c++ and that’s
a great compliant compiler

Could someone at QSSL PLEASE consider this option
We’re having a lot of troubles with gcc

5

“Rennie Allen” <RAllen@csical.com> wrote in message
news:64F00D816A85D51198390050046F80C996DD@exchangecal.hq.csical.com…

Very interesting (if the statement about ISO compliance is true). I
would sure like to have a C++ compiler that could actually compile C++
code !

Since Comeau is a front end (generates C code) how does one handle
debugging?

-----Original Message-----
From: Colin Burgess [mailto:> cburgess@qnx.com> ]
Posted At: Friday, August 24, 2001 11:08 AM
Posted To: devtools
Conversation: Comeau C++
Subject: Re: Comeau C++


Thanks, I’ll take a look.

Tom <> the_wid@my-deja.com> > wrote:
Has Comeau C++ been considered by the QNX team as an alternative C++
(and C99)
compiler? It only costs $50 a license (which I would be very happy to
pay). Its
back end generates C code, and many ports to custom platforms,
including
embedded ones, are already available. Existing ports to gcc on several
platforms
should make the QNX port very easy (and cheap!)…

If executable sizes and speeds are good, then it might just be the
solution for
the C++ developers annoyed by g++. It also happens to be, when
combined with
the Dinkumware C and C++ Libraries, the most ISO compliant C++
compiler
available. It also has a large number of compatibility switches for
compiling
older code.

Check out > www.comeaucomputing.com

Tom


\

cburgess@qnx.com

6

I suppose we are back to “printf” debugging. Or, we could used a debugger on
the generated “C” code, not a pretty prospect but at least a step up from
“printf” style. Watcom updated to ANSI plus the kickass wd would be an ideal
solution but this cfront sounds helpful in the meantime.

Mario Charest wrote:

“Rennie Allen” <> RAllen@csical.com> > wrote in message
news:> 64F00D816A85D51198390050046F80C996DD@exchangecal.hq.csical.com> …
Very interesting (if the statement about ISO compliance is true). I
would sure like to have a C++ compiler that could actually compile C++
code !


Since Comeau is a front end (generates C code) how does one handle
debugging?

-----Original Message-----
From: Colin Burgess [mailto:> cburgess@qnx.com> ]
Posted At: Friday, August 24, 2001 11:08 AM
Posted To: devtools
Conversation: Comeau C++
Subject: Re: Comeau C++


Thanks, I’ll take a look.

Tom <> the_wid@my-deja.com> > wrote:
Has Comeau C++ been considered by the QNX team as an alternative C++
(and C99)
compiler? It only costs $50 a license (which I would be very happy to
pay). Its
back end generates C code, and many ports to custom platforms,
including
embedded ones, are already available. Existing ports to gcc on several
platforms
should make the QNX port very easy (and cheap!)…

If executable sizes and speeds are good, then it might just be the
solution for
the C++ developers annoyed by g++. It also happens to be, when
combined with
the Dinkumware C and C++ Libraries, the most ISO compliant C++
compiler
available. It also has a large number of compatibility switches for
compiling
older code.

Check out > www.comeaucomputing.com

Tom


\

cburgess@qnx.com

7

Dean Douthat <ddouthat@faac.com> wrote:

I suppose we are back to “printf” debugging. Or, we could used a debugger on
the generated “C” code, not a pretty prospect but at least a step up from
“printf” style. Watcom updated to ANSI plus the kickass wd would be an ideal
solution but this cfront sounds helpful in the meantime.

Mario Charest wrote:

As read in comeaucomputing.com, there’s not only the cfront compiler, but
there’s the ability to generate directly the object code (and I think debug
it as usual).

Just for curiosity: I never used qnx4 but as read in many posts it used the
watcom c/c++ compiler. I used it a lot in dos environments and it was a great
compiler, if not the best for that time. Why do not use it in qnx6?

Is effectively watcom discontinued? :frowning:

–
Wave++

8

“Wave++” <wavexx@apexmail.com> wrote in message
news:9n2nrk$d7d$1@inn.qnx.com…

Dean Douthat <> ddouthat@faac.com> > wrote:
I suppose we are back to “printf” debugging. Or, we could used a
debugger on
the generated “C” code, not a pretty prospect but at least a step up
from
“printf” style. Watcom updated to ANSI plus the kickass wd would be an
ideal
solution but this cfront sounds helpful in the meantime.

Mario Charest wrote:

As read in comeaucomputing.com, there’s not only the cfront compiler, but
there’s the ability to generate directly the object code (and I think
debug
it as usual).

Just for curiosity: I never used qnx4 but as read in many posts it used
the
watcom c/c++ compiler. I used it a lot in dos environments and it was a
great
compiler, if not the best for that time. Why do not use it in qnx6?

Is effectively watcom discontinued? > :frowning:

Yes it is (for quite a while actually). Sybase moved await from compiler
market all together. Sybase released the source to watcom and
there are faint signs of revival.


–
Wave++

9

I’m not sure, however, the mere fact that a compiler uses C as its
object code does not preclude debugging (any more than using assembler
or machine code as object code precludes debugging).
It is important to differentiate “emitting C as object code” and “being
a front end”. A pure “front end” by definition has no “back end”
components, which Comeau C++ does seem to require.

Comeau refers to a “compiler helper” runtime binary, and “helper tools”
during the compilation process (the web page isn’t clear on the purpose
of these helper tools, but if Comeau C++ were truly a pure front end
then it wouldn’t have “helper tools” would it ?).

I suspect that these “helper tools” add time to the compilation process,
and as such Comeau doesn’t like to focus on their existance. Personally,
I can stand longer compiles, but I have little tolerance for lack of
standards compliance (IMO a language borders on useless if it is not
standardized or the standard is not widely implemented).

-----Original Message-----
From: Mario Charest [mailto:mcharest@zinformatic.com]
Posted At: Tuesday, September 04, 2001 4:53 AM
Posted To: devtools
Conversation: Comeau C++
Subject: Re: Comeau C++



“Rennie Allen” <RAllen@csical.com> wrote in message
news:64F00D816A85D51198390050046F80C996DD@exchangecal.hq.csical.com…

Very interesting (if the statement about ISO compliance is true). I
would sure like to have a C++ compiler that could actually compile C++
code !

Since Comeau is a front end (generates C code) how does one handle
debugging?

-----Original Message-----
From: Colin Burgess [mailto:> cburgess@qnx.com> ]
Posted At: Friday, August 24, 2001 11:08 AM
Posted To: devtools
Conversation: Comeau C++
Subject: Re: Comeau C++


Thanks, I’ll take a look.

Tom <> the_wid@my-deja.com> > wrote:
Has Comeau C++ been considered by the QNX team as an alternative C++
(and C99)
compiler? It only costs $50 a license (which I would be very happy
to
pay). Its
back end generates C code, and many ports to custom platforms,
including
embedded ones, are already available. Existing ports to gcc on
several
platforms
should make the QNX port very easy (and cheap!)…

If executable sizes and speeds are good, then it might just be the
solution for
the C++ developers annoyed by g++. It also happens to be, when
combined with
the Dinkumware C and C++ Libraries, the most ISO compliant C++
compiler
available. It also has a large number of compatibility switches for
compiling
older code.

Check out > www.comeaucomputing.com

Tom


\

cburgess@qnx.com

10

It’s come to my attention that although I’ve been posting to this
NG for a few weeks, that my messages have only propagated to
my ISPs local news server (I was wondering why nobody answered
anything that I said!!). Can somebody post (just one person
please) here that this message actually got posted to the actual
QNX server (I think that’s how this NG is set up)? Thanks.

Greg Comeau export ETA: Dec 1 10% “End of Summer” Offer
Comeau C/C++ ONLINE ==> http://www.comeaucomputing.com/tryitout
World Class Compilers: Breathtaking C++, Amazing C99, Fabulous C90.
Comeau C/C++ with Dinkumware’s Libraries… Have you tried it?

11

Hi Greg…

Yup! Your message got through this one time!

I wonder, are you in any way related to ‘Comeau C++’? If so, I suppose
that we all want to hear from you.

Bests…

Miguel.



Greg Comeau wrote:

It’s come to my attention that although I’ve been posting to this
NG for a few weeks, that my messages have only propagated to
my ISPs local news server (I was wondering why nobody answered
anything that I said!!). Can somebody post (just one person
please) here that this message actually got posted to the actual
QNX server (I think that’s how this NG is set up)? Thanks.

Greg Comeau export ETA: Dec 1 10% “End of Summer” Offer
Comeau C/C++ ONLINE ==> > http://www.comeaucomputing.com/tryitout
World Class Compilers: Breathtaking C++, Amazing C99, Fabulous C90.
Comeau C/C++ with Dinkumware’s Libraries… Have you tried it?

–

my opinions are mine, only mine, solely mine, and they are not related
in any possible way to the institution(s) in which I study and work.

Miguel Simon
Research Engineer
School of Aerospace and Mechanical Engineering
University of Oklahoma
http://www.amerobotics.ou.edu/
http://www.saic.com

12

Hi Colin…

I wonder if you have any more comment on the subject?

Bests…

Miguel.


Colin Burgess wrote:

Thanks, I’ll take a look.

Tom <> the_wid@my-deja.com> > wrote:
Has Comeau C++ been considered by the QNX team as an alternative C++ (and C99)
compiler? It only costs $50 a license (which I would be very happy to pay). Its
back end generates C code, and many ports to custom platforms, including
embedded ones, are already available. Existing ports to gcc on several platforms
should make the QNX port very easy (and cheap!)…

If executable sizes and speeds are good, then it might just be the solution for
the C++ developers annoyed by g++. It also happens to be, when combined with
the Dinkumware C and C++ Libraries, the most ISO compliant C++ compiler
available. It also has a large number of compatibility switches for compiling
older code.

Check out > www.comeaucomputing.com

Tom

–
cburgess@qnx.com

–

my opinions are mine, only mine, solely mine, and they are not related
in any possible way to the institution(s) in which I study and work.

Miguel Simon
Research Engineer
School of Aerospace and Mechanical Engineering
University of Oklahoma
http://www.amerobotics.ou.edu/
http://www.saic.com

13

In article <3B95943A.F7408DFF@ou.edu>, Miguel Simon <simon@ou.edu> wrote:

Hi Greg…

Yup! Your message got through this one time!

I wonder, are you in any way related to ‘Comeau C++’? If so, I suppose
that we all want to hear from you.

I’ll go back and repost my other messages then…

Greg Comeau export ETA: Dec 1 10% “End of Summer” Offer
Comeau C/C++ ONLINE ==> http://www.comeaucomputing.com/tryitout
World Class Compilers: Breathtaking C++, Amazing C99, Fabulous C90.
Comeau C/C++ with Dinkumware’s Libraries… Have you tried it?

14

Rennie Allen <RAllen@csical.com> wrote:

Colin Burgess <> cburgess@qnx.com> > wrote:
Tom <> the_wid@my-deja.com> > wrote:
Has Comeau C++ been considered by the QNX team as an alternative C++
(and C99) compiler? It only costs $50 a license (which I would be
very happy to pay).

And we’d be very happy to have you pay. :slight_smile: Currently though,
it would need a custom port to be available for QNX.

Its back end generates C code, and many ports to custom platforms,
including embedded ones, are already available.

Correct.

Existing ports to gcc on several platforms should make the QNX port
very easy (and cheap!)…

Well, easier, but various things still need to occur for us
to do a custom port.

If executable sizes and speeds are good, then it might just be the
solution for the C++ developers annoyed by g++.

As you mention, we’d use gcc anyway. So we’d mostly be comparable
with it.

It also happens to be, when combined with the Dinkumware C and
C++ Libraries, the most ISO compliant C++ compiler available.

Not to mentioned C90 and C99. :slight_smile:

It also has a large number of compatibility switches for compiling
older code.
Check out > www.comeaucomputing.com

Yes, it’s highly dialectable. :slight_smile:

Thanks, I’ll take a look.

Very interesting (if the statement about ISO compliance is true).

Of course, there is not yet any compliant C++ compiler.
But it’s true that we’re close language-wise. Check out the CUJ
compiler review from April, which is available online, then add
2 upgrades and the Dinkumware libs.

I would sure like to have a C++ compiler that could actually
compile C++ code !

It’ll need some bureaucracy first.

Greg Comeau export ETA: Dec 1 10% “End of Summer” Offer
Comeau C/C++ ONLINE ==> http://www.comeaucomputing.com/tryitout
World Class Compilers: Breathtaking C++, Amazing C99, Fabulous C90.
Comeau C/C++ with Dinkumware’s Libraries… Have you tried it?

15

In article <be3a5d9a.0108281547.144f5178@posting.google.com>,
Tom <tom_usenet@hotmail.com> wrote:

comeau@panix.com > (Greg Comeau) wrote in message news:<9mgfdd$pq5$> 1@panix3.panix.com> >…
If executable sizes and speeds are good, then it might just be the
solution for the C++ developers annoyed by g++.

As you mention, we’d use gcc anyway. So we’d mostly be comparable
with it.

Do you have a C++ optimiser between the C++ front end and the C back
end? Eliding and reusing temporaries, optimising small objects into
separate C variables, stuff like that? I did read about the empty base
optimisation on your site, which will be helpful if I decide to try
out Loki.

There is currently no additional step between the two phases.
Often though the C compiler is able to do lots with it,
though of course not every single thing.

The problem I was having with g++ is its ridiculous inability to
remove duplicate template instantiations in different compilation
units, due to the fact that they can’t write a new linker and they
haven’t got around to a pre-linker yet. I’ve always received linker
errors when trying -frepo on anything except toy examples. I believe
Comeau C++ solves this with a pre-linker of some kind. What effect
does the whole CFront model compilation process have on compilation
time?

It takes longer, but it also works :slight_smile: Furthermore, although we support
the cfront model (which we call “implicit inclusion”)
(see http://www.comeaucomputing.com/4.0/docs/userman/ati.html )
we prefer our automatic instantiation (the default) through
which object files “own” instantiations. This too takes longer
but also works :slight_smile: Note that in “takes longer”, this applies
to the initial compile. Upon subsequent compiles, it will have
most or all of the info it already needs.

How about if the Borland model is used - do you remove duplicate
instantiations?

We “absorb” the Borland model through the ownership scheme,
so yes, duplicates get “removed”.

Greg Comeau export ETA: Dec 1 10% “End of Summer” Offer
Comeau C/C++ ONLINE ==> http://www.comeaucomputing.com/tryitout
World Class Compilers: Breathtaking C++, Amazing C99, Fabulous C90.
Comeau C/C++ with Dinkumware’s Libraries… Have you tried it?

16

In article <9n2fdq$9a6$1@inn.qnx.com>,
Mario Charest <mcharest@zinformatic.com> wrote:

“Rennie Allen” <> RAllen@csical.com> > wrote in message
news:> 64F00D816A85D51198390050046F80C996DD@exchangecal.hq.csical.com> …
Very interesting (if the statement about ISO compliance is true). I
would sure like to have a C++ compiler that could actually compile C++
code !

Since Comeau is a front end (generates C code) how does one handle
debugging?

You’d use como -g (or whatver gets chosen) and then just run
your debugger.

Greg Comeau export ETA: Dec 1 10% “End of Summer” Offer
Comeau C/C++ ONLINE ==> http://www.comeaucomputing.com/tryitout
World Class Compilers: Breathtaking C++, Amazing C99, Fabulous C90.
Comeau C/C++ with Dinkumware’s Libraries… Have you tried it?

17

Colin is currently on vacation as I understand it.

In article <3B95947F.10F79461@ou.edu>, Miguel Simon <simon@ou.edu> wrote:

Hi Colin…

I wonder if you have any more comment on the subject?

Colin Burgess wrote:

Thanks, I’ll take a look.

Tom <> the_wid@my-deja.com> > wrote:
Has Comeau C++ been considered by the QNX team as an alternative C++ (and C99)
compiler? It only costs $50 a license (which I would be very happy to pay). Its
back end generates C code, and many ports to custom platforms, including
embedded ones, are already available. Existing ports to gcc on several platforms
should make the QNX port very easy (and cheap!)…

If executable sizes and speeds are good, then it might just be the solution for
the C++ developers annoyed by g++. It also happens to be, when combined with
the Dinkumware C and C++ Libraries, the most ISO compliant C++ compiler
available. It also has a large number of compatibility switches for compiling
older code.

Check out > www.comeaucomputing.com

Greg Comeau export ETA: Dec 1 10% “End of Summer” Offer
Comeau C/C++ ONLINE ==> http://www.comeaucomputing.com/tryitout
World Class Compilers: Breathtaking C++, Amazing C99, Fabulous C90.
Comeau C/C++ with Dinkumware’s Libraries… Have you tried it?

18

In article <3B94E0F5.4C3381C3@faac.com>,
Dean Douthat <ddouthat@faac.com> wrote:

Mario Charest wrote:
“Rennie Allen” <> RAllen@csical.com> > wrote in message
news:> 64F00D816A85D51198390050046F80C996DD@exchangecal.hq.csical.com> …
Very interesting (if the statement about ISO compliance is true). I
would sure like to have a C++ compiler that could actually compile C++
code !

Since Comeau is a front end (generates C code) how does one handle
debugging?

I suppose we are back to “printf” debugging.

You shouldn’t need to do that.

Or, we could used a debugger on the generated “C” code,

You shouldn’t need to do that either (at least not if the
debugger is written correctly).

not a pretty prospect but at least a step up from
“printf” style.

Well, I won’t say it’s been perfect, but I will say that
it’s better than that… at least it has been so on
the platforms we’ve been on for the past decase.

Watcom updated to ANSI plus the kickass wd would be an ideal
solution but this cfront sounds helpful in the meantime.

Whadya mean “meantime”? :slight_smile:

Seriously, bringing something to the state of “updated to ANSI”
is a fairly lengthy, costly and meticulous task.

Greg Comeau export ETA: Dec 1 10% “End of Summer” Offer
Comeau C/C++ ONLINE ==> http://www.comeaucomputing.com/tryitout
World Class Compilers: Breathtaking C++, Amazing C99, Fabulous C90.
Comeau C/C++ with Dinkumware’s Libraries… Have you tried it?

19

In article <9n2nrk$d7d$1@inn.qnx.com>, Wave++ <wavexx@apexmail.com> wrote:

Dean Douthat <> ddouthat@faac.com> > wrote:
I suppose we are back to “printf” debugging. Or, we could used
a debugger on the generated “C” code, not a pretty prospect but
at least a step up from “printf” style. Watcom updated to ANSI
plus the kickass wd would be an ideal solution but this cfront
sounds helpful in the meantime.

As read in comeaucomputing.com, there’s not only the cfront compiler,
but there’s the ability to generate directly the object code (and
I think debug it as usual).

(We’re not cfront, just that some aspect funtion similarly.)
Anyway, the point is to sell folks something that, when combo
with a specific C compiler, will generate object code,
w/o the user needing to do anthing special.

That means extensively porting and testing it with specific
C compilers, and with specific debuggers.

Greg Comeau export ETA: Dec 1 10% “End of Summer” Offer
Comeau C/C++ ONLINE ==> http://www.comeaucomputing.com/tryitout
World Class Compilers: Breathtaking C++, Amazing C99, Fabulous C90.
Comeau C/C++ with Dinkumware’s Libraries… Have you tried it?

20

In article <64F00D816A85D51198390050046F80C9AA37@exchangecal.hq.csical.com>,
Rennie Allen <RAllen@csical.com> wrote:

I’m not sure, however, the mere fact that a compiler uses C as its
object code does not preclude debugging (any more than using assembler
or machine code as object code precludes debugging).
It is important to differentiate “emitting C as object code” and “being
a front end”. A pure “front end” by definition has no “back end”
components, which Comeau C++ does seem to require.

The point is that it’s whatever the vendor can make out of it.
A so-called direct native code producing compiler doesn’t
work with any debugger at the source code level too. The vendor
must “make it so”. It’s no different here.

Comeau refers to a “compiler helper” runtime binary, and “helper tools”
during the compilation process (the web page isn’t clear on the purpose
of these helper tools, but if Comeau C++ were truly a pure front end
then it wouldn’t have “helper tools” would it ?).

We specifically tailor those things to the platform (where platform
is defined as includeing at least the CPU, OS and C compiler).

I suspect that these “helper tools” add time to the compilation process,
and as such Comeau doesn’t like to focus on their existance.

They add on to the compilation time of any C++ compiler.
How much depends upon too many things to qualify here.
For instance, on some platforms we’ve been know to be slower than
the native code compilers, on others we’ve been know to be faster).

Personally,
I can stand longer compiles, but I have little tolerance for lack of
standards compliance (IMO a language borders on useless if it is not
standardized or the standard is not widely implemented).

All things need to be taken into consideration, but yes, if it’s
wrong, it doesn’t matter how fast it can be wrong :slight_smile:

Greg Comeau export ETA: Dec 1 10% “End of Summer” Offer
Comeau C/C++ ONLINE ==> http://www.comeaucomputing.com/tryitout
World Class Compilers: Breathtaking C++, Amazing C99, Fabulous C90.
Comeau C/C++ with Dinkumware’s Libraries… Have you tried it?