QNX Usability

QNX Newsgroups (Archives) comp.os.qnx
1

Firstly, I’d like to thank all of you who responded to my first question :wink:

Secondly, I’m using Windows95 right now – for those of you who don’t know,
Win95 is like one great big terminal error. I’m probably going to buy
a new PC soon, and am considering several OS’ as either stand-alone or dual
boot OS’:

FreeBSD
OpenBSD
Linux(Slackware, Stampede, or Debian)
BeOS
IRIX
Amiga (the new remake of Amiga, and probably as a dual boot)
V2OS(also, probably only as a dual boot)
OS/2
Athe-OS
RISCOS
QNX/Neutrino


Ok, what I’m wondering is, is QNX a viable OS for a personal private user
like myself . . . is the GUI easy to use, and does it provide as much
funcitonality as the Win95 GUI? Also, are there programs in it that allow
me to do the following, or does it support the following:

(1) Cable internet access(Road Runner
(2) Printer compatability(preferrably with a Xeros WorkCentre 450c)
(3) Gaming(and preferrably a type of gaming client which would allow
multiplayer, such as Kali or Kahn)
(4) A sophisticated and intuitive e-mail/newsgroup program like
Outlook
Express(preferrably without the security bugs)
(5) A sophisticated browser like Opera(or preferrably a way to port
the beta Linux
Opera to it)
(6) A sophisticated catch-all word processing program which allows
you to do
spreadsheets, databases, communications, word-documents
(7) A sophisticated graphics program(s) which allows for image
editing, and a
simple one like MS’ Paint
(8) Sophisticated 3D creation programs like Bryce or Poser
(9) Compatability with Voice Command programs or the ability to port
Linux Voice
controlled programs to it
(10) A high level of customizability and tweakability . . . i.e., I
want to be able to
change every aspect of how it looks, and how it functions;
for example, I want to
be able to define how many concurrent connections it connects
to the net with,
the MaxMTU values, and make a number of other performance
tweaks, such as
defining the size of the cache file, or(preferably) making a
cache file on a
separate partition)

And one question: how does it compare to BeOS and V2OS in terms of
responsiveness and speed? How much of it was, like V2OS, coded in
assembler?

Well, I realize that’s a long list, but I like to do adequate research.



P.S.: If anyone knows of a place where I could test out different OS’ on
platforms – so I could see first hand how they operate – please tell me.
Thanks.

\

“He who controls the past commands the future. He who commands the future
conquers the past.” – Orwell

2

I’m very sorry about the fragmented nature of this message; when I was
typing it, on my window, it looked like all the paragraphs were aligned.
Hope you can manage the horrible indentation.

3

Gatsby <heinrich@rochester.rr.com> wrote in message
news:D4tc5.14636$PD4.520278@typhoon.nyroc.rr.com…

Firstly, I’d like to thank all of you who responded to my first question
:wink:

Secondly, I’m using Windows95 right now – for those of you who don’t
know,
Win95 is like one great big terminal error. I’m probably going to
buy
a new PC soon, and am considering several OS’ as either stand-alone or
dual
boot OS’:

FreeBSD
OpenBSD
Linux(Slackware, Stampede, or Debian)
BeOS
IRIX
Amiga (the new remake of Amiga, and probably as a dual boot)

You can run it on a Wintel machine?

V2OS(also, probably only as a dual boot)
OS/2
Athe-OS
RISCOS
QNX/Neutrino


Ok, what I’m wondering is, is QNX a viable OS for a personal private user
like myself . . .

Depends on what you are doing.
It’s umteens more reliable than Windows 98, but the supported hardware list
is much shorter.
Also the software available for Windows 98 … well you get the idea.

is the GUI easy to use, and does it provide as much
funcitonality as the Win95 GUI?

It’s very easy to use. It might not have all the “functionality features”
that Windows 98 has, but it’s a hell of a lot more stable.

Also, are there programs in it that allow
me to do the following, or does it support the following:

(1) Cable internet access(Road Runner

Not sure where they stand with this right now.

(2) Printer compatability(preferrably with a Xeros WorkCentre 450c)
(3) Gaming(and preferrably a type of gaming client which would
allow
multiplayer, such as Kali or Kahn)

If you’re talking QNX Realtime Platform, it comes with Quake 3 Arena demo…
so the possibility is there.

(4) A sophisticated and intuitive e-mail/newsgroup program like
Outlook
Express(preferrably without the security bugs)
(5) A sophisticated browser like Opera(or preferrably a way to port
the beta Linux
Opera to it)

The Realtime Platform comes with a web browser, it’s own Voyager, and a
Mozilla port.

(6) A sophisticated catch-all word processing program which allows
you to do
spreadsheets, databases, communications, word-documents

Not sure if there are any 3rd party solutions like this.

Well, I realize that’s a long list, but I like to do adequate research.



P.S.: If anyone knows of a place where I could test out different OS’ on
platforms – so I could see first hand how they operate – please tell me.
Thanks.

QNX demos many versions of their OS at their headquarters in Kanata… :slight_smile:

–
“He who controls the past commands the future. He who commands the future
conquers the past.” – Orwell

4

trying to answer some of your questions on QNX :wink:

Gatsby schrieb:

Firstly, I’d like to thank all of you who responded to my first question > :wink:

Secondly, I’m using Windows95 right now – for those of you who don’t know,
Win95 is like one great big terminal error. I’m probably going to buy
a new PC soon, and am considering several OS’ as either stand-alone or dual
boot OS’:

FreeBSD
OpenBSD
Linux(Slackware, Stampede, or Debian)
BeOS
IRIX
Amiga (the new remake of Amiga, and probably as a dual boot)
V2OS(also, probably only as a dual boot)
OS/2
Athe-OS
RISCOS
QNX/Neutrino

Ok, what I’m wondering is, is QNX a viable OS for a personal private user
yes definitely, very stable user interface is unix like without the gra

fical interface - but with the grafical interface (microGUI Photon) it
is just super … stable …

like myself . . . is the GUI easy to use, and does it provide as much
funcitonality as the Win95 GUI? Also, are there programs in it that allow
me to do the following, or does it support the following:

(1) Cable internet access(Road Runner
what you mean? TCPIP is completely available incl. web-browsers …
(2) Printer compatability(preferrably with a Xeros WorkCentre 450c)

Postscript printers are connectable and most of the HP line stuff
you have to check with the Kanata people (http://www.qnx.com)

(3) Gaming(and preferrably a type of gaming client which would allow
multiplayer, such as Kali or Kahn)

should be possible, I saw some ports from other OS’s

(4) A sophisticated and intuitive e-mail/newsgroup program like
Outlook
Express(preferrably without the security bugs)
available (vmail, GUI-based), very useful but not quite as sophisticated

as outlook

(5) A sophisticated browser like Opera(or preferrably a way to port
the beta Linux
Opera to it)
yes - voyager, lynx and some others…
(6) A sophisticated catch-all word processing program which allows
you to do
spreadsheets, databases, communications, word-documents
perhaps third party products -see webpage of QNX
(7) A sophisticated graphics program(s) which allows for image
editing, and a
simple one like MS’ Paint
see (6)
(8) Sophisticated 3D creation programs like Bryce or Poser
see (6)
(9) Compatability with Voice Command programs or the ability to port
Linux Voice
controlled programs to it
??
(10) A high level of customizability and tweakability . . . i.e., I
want to be able to
change every aspect of how it looks, and how it functions;
for example, I want to
be able to define how many concurrent connections it connects
to the net with,
the MaxMTU values, and make a number of other performance
tweaks, such as
defining the size of the cache file, or(preferably) making a
cache file on a
separate partition)

should be possible, configurable as most UNIX systems

And one question: how does it compare to BeOS and V2OS in terms of
responsiveness and speed? How much of it was, like V2OS, coded in
assembler?

Well, I realize that’s a long list, but I like to do adequate research.

P.S.: If anyone knows of a place where I could test out different OS’ on
platforms – so I could see first hand how they operate – please tell me.
Thanks.

–
“He who controls the past commands the future. He who commands the future
conquers the past.” – Orwell

–

Joerg Kampmann
IBK-Consult - (embedded Systems)
WWW: http://www.ibk-consult.de

5

with such requests imho forget about qnx4/neutrino and use smth more
user friendly like linux or bsd if you wanna unix style os or maybe beos5
(nice toy). but the more i’m swinging in different os-es the more i realize
for myself that for the general user requests you mentioned above the best
sollution is windows, preferable NT or maybe 2000. yet, the stability of
this systems should be slightly better and bug list report’s size seems to
reach os distributive size, but at lest it works and works quite well for
user.

ps: look at os/2 merlin (os/2 4.0), imho very nice home single user os.

pss: personally i use qnx4 as my daily desktop system, but i don’t need most
of things you mentioned and on the other hand need just clean stable
comfortable networking development environment. this case qnx4 imho is the
best. of couse, bsd/linux is very well too, but it just has become a habbit
to use qnx4 for such tasks :slight_smile:

–

Thanks for your attention,
Ian M. Zagorskih, Software Developer, Novosoft Ltd.
E-Mail: ianzag@pochta.net ICQ 28632525
Web: http://www.novosoft.ru

// wbr

“Gatsby” <heinrich@rochester.rr.com> wrote in message
news:D4tc5.14636$PD4.520278@typhoon.nyroc.rr.com…

Firstly, I’d like to thank all of you who responded to my first question
:wink:

Secondly, I’m using Windows95 right now – for those of you who don’t
know,
Win95 is like one great big terminal error. I’m probably going to
buy
a new PC soon, and am considering several OS’ as either stand-alone or
dual
boot OS’:

FreeBSD
OpenBSD
Linux(Slackware, Stampede, or Debian)
BeOS
IRIX
Amiga (the new remake of Amiga, and probably as a dual boot)
V2OS(also, probably only as a dual boot)
OS/2
Athe-OS
RISCOS
QNX/Neutrino


Ok, what I’m wondering is, is QNX a viable OS for a personal private user
like myself . . . is the GUI easy to use, and does it provide as much
funcitonality as the Win95 GUI? Also, are there programs in it that allow
me to do the following, or does it support the following:

(1) Cable internet access(Road Runner
(2) Printer compatability(preferrably with a Xeros WorkCentre 450c)
(3) Gaming(and preferrably a type of gaming client which would
allow
multiplayer, such as Kali or Kahn)
(4) A sophisticated and intuitive e-mail/newsgroup program like
Outlook
Express(preferrably without the security bugs)
(5) A sophisticated browser like Opera(or preferrably a way to port
the beta Linux
Opera to it)
(6) A sophisticated catch-all word processing program which allows
you to do
spreadsheets, databases, communications, word-documents
(7) A sophisticated graphics program(s) which allows for image
editing, and a
simple one like MS’ Paint
(8) Sophisticated 3D creation programs like Bryce or Poser
(9) Compatability with Voice Command programs or the ability to
port
Linux Voice
controlled programs to it
(10) A high level of customizability and tweakability . . . i.e., I
want to be able to
change every aspect of how it looks, and how it functions;
for example, I want to
be able to define how many concurrent connections it
connects
to the net with,
the MaxMTU values, and make a number of other performance
tweaks, such as
defining the size of the cache file, or(preferably) making
a
cache file on a
separate partition)

And one question: how does it compare to BeOS and V2OS in terms of
responsiveness and speed? How much of it was, like V2OS, coded in
assembler?

Well, I realize that’s a long list, but I like to do adequate research.



P.S.: If anyone knows of a place where I could test out different OS’ on
platforms – so I could see first hand how they operate – please tell me.
Thanks.

\

“He who controls the past commands the future. He who commands the future
conquers the past.” – Orwell

6

On Mon, 17 Jul 2000, Gatsby wrote:

FreeBSD
OpenBSD
NetBSD

have less support than linux but you can run most linux apps. A bit
more structured than most linux dists.

Linux(Slackware, Stampede, or Debian)
why not mandrake linux? the best i think. the latest release have

reiserFS(journaling filesystem) and xfree86 4.0. Mandrake and latest wine
and you should be able to run more apps than windows. www.winehq.com

BeOS
To bad they change so much between every version that old apps wont run on

the latest version :frowning:

IRIX
does it run on a pc?
Amiga (the new remake of Amiga, and probably as a dual boot)
you can buy it and run it in linux now development system. Might be a

stand alone os soon dont know http://www.amiga.com/products/SDK.shtml.
Then you have AROS
http://www.aros.org/
a port of amiga os 3.1. it runs in linux now but there is a native 386
version on the way.

V2OS(also, probably only as a dual boot)
nice fast os, but not many apps.



OS/2
some compatibility to windows apps mostly 3.11



Athe-OS
not many apps.



RISCOS
hmm for pc?



QNX/Neutrino
Think it should be able to run most linux apps so it should be easy to

port lots of programs with a recompile. maybe kmail and Abiword
maybe wine (then you could run most windows apps NT,98,dos)



\

Henrik.Berglund@mds.mdh.se
http://www.mds.mdh.se/~adb94hbd/

7

“Gatsby” <heinrich@rochester.rr.com> wrote in message
news:D4tc5.14636$PD4.520278@typhoon.nyroc.rr.com…

Firstly, I’d like to thank all of you who responded to my first question
:wink:

Secondly, I’m using Windows95 right now – for those of you who don’t
know,
Win95 is like one great big terminal error. I’m probably going to
buy
a new PC soon, and am considering several OS’ as either stand-alone or
dual
boot OS’:

FreeBSD
OpenBSD
Linux(Slackware, Stampede, or Debian)
BeOS
IRIX
Amiga (the new remake of Amiga, and probably as a dual boot)
V2OS(also, probably only as a dual boot)
OS/2
Athe-OS
RISCOS
QNX/Neutrino

You should add Win2000 to this list I beleive.

Ok, what I’m wondering is, is QNX a viable OS for a personal private user
like myself . .

Not today, in my opinion, unless you do very little with your
machine aside development.

Unless you use XFree86 (ported to QNX) and then get some
program ported.

. is the GUI easy to use, and does it provide as much
funcitonality as the Win95 GUI? Also, are there programs in it that allow
me to do the following, or does it support the following:

(1) Cable internet access(Road Runner

Yes.

(2) Printer compatability(preferrably with a Xeros WorkCentre 450c)

If it’s Postscript yes, but then there are no fancy word processor

(3) Gaming(and preferrably a type of gaming client which would
allow
multiplayer, such as Kali or Kahn)

On QNX4 only doom.

(4) A sophisticated and intuitive e-mail/newsgroup program like
Outlook
Express(preferrably without the security bugs)

You can do email and news but it’s far from sophisticated…

(5) A sophisticated browser like Opera(or preferrably a way to port
the beta Linux
Opera to it)

On QNX4 there is Voyager.

(6) A sophisticated catch-all word processing program which allows
you to do
spreadsheets, databases, communications, word-documents

On QNX4/Photon nop. On XFree86 maybe.

(7) A sophisticated graphics program(s) which allows for image
editing, and a simple one like MS’ Paint

On QNX4/Photon nop. On XFree86 maybe.

(8) Sophisticated 3D creation programs like Bryce or Poser

On QNX4/Photon nop. On XFree86 maybe.

(9) Compatability with Voice Command programs or the ability to
port
Linux Voice controlled programs to it

(10) A high level of customizability and tweakability . . . i.e., I
want to be able to
change every aspect of how it looks, and how it functions;
for example, I want to
be able to define how many concurrent connections it
connects
to the net with,
the MaxMTU values, and make a number of other performance
tweaks, such as
defining the size of the cache file, or(preferably) making
a
cache file on a
separate partition)

Under QNX there is no SWAP file ( I assume that’s what you mean my cache
file on
a separate partion)

And one question: how does it compare to BeOS and V2OS in terms of
responsiveness and speed? How much of it was, like V2OS, coded in
assembler?

I most coded in C, I don’t think today C over assembly make a big big
difference.
The difference is in the architechture. QNX4 is definitely fast!

Well, I realize that’s a long list, but I like to do adequate research.


QRTP it’s on it’s way and will probably fit your bill better then QNX4.



P.S.: If anyone knows of a place where I could test out different OS’ on
platforms – so I could see first hand how they operate – please tell me.
Thanks.

I think you are looking for something that doesn’t exits… I have solve
this
dilmena by having 3 computers where each has NT2000, WinMe, QNX4 and QRTP.
They are all network, I haven’t try BeOS or Linux cause I’m happy with
mysetup.
I use what ever OS fits the requirement of the task at hand…

Doing an extensive research like your is extremely time consuming an
expensive,
much cheap IMHO to run a few of them, then to find the “perfect” one.

  • I’v stop looking for a “MS’ Paint” like program on QNX4 : I use MS’Paint
    on Windows…
  • I’v stop looking for an Outlook like program on QNX4, I use Outlook on
    NT2000
  • I’v stop looking for a voice control on QNX4, I useddraggon naturaly
    speaking on NT2000.
  • I’v stop fighting with VisualC++ on Windows, I use vi/vedit on QNX4 and
    QRTP…

If you look for a car that feels like a BMW but that sounds like a Ferrari,
you won’t find it. You could design your own, but’s simpler to lower your
requirement or buy both.

You get the picture.

  • Mario




    –

“He who controls the past commands the future. He who commands the future
conquers the past.” – Orwell

8

QNX/Neutrino
Think it should be able to run most linux apps so it should be easy to
port lots of programs with a recompile. maybe kmail and Abiword
maybe wine (then you could run most windows apps NT,98,dos)

Abiword has been ported to QRTP.

Henrik.Berglund@mds.mdh.se
http://www.mds.mdh.se/~adb94hbd/

9

Under QNX there is no SWAP file ( I assume that’s what you mean my cache
file on
a separate partion)
No SWAP file?? What happens if one runs out of RAM? How does the OS deal

with the lack of adequate RAM?? I’ve always thought that it was standard
policy, and good for performance, to have a fixed SWAP file that’s at
least twice or thrice the size of one’s RAM.


QRTP it’s on it’s way and will probably fit your bill better then QNX4
What is the difference between QNX4 OS, Photon OS, and QRTP? Different

versions of the same base product, more advanced versions(i.e., as in
Win3.1, Win95, Win98, Win2000, WinME)


If you look for a car that feels like a BMW but that sounds like a Ferrari,
you won’t find it <snip
Well, maybe…there are Porsches, which have the power of a Ferarri and

the inside Luxery(at least 4 2 ppl) of a BMW…but I get your point –
always a compromise.

10

Note: in the message I’m responding to, I said “What is the difference
between QNX, Photon, and QRMX?” I mean to say, "What is the difference
between QNX, Neutrino . . . " Sorry all, and thanks for all your useful
responses.

David J. Heinrich
dh003i@mail.rochester.edu
dh003i@yahoo.com
heinrich@rochester.rr.com

“If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stomping on a human face
– forever.” – Orwell, 1984

11

On Mon, 17 Jul 2000, Mario Charest wrote:

QNX/Neutrino
Think it should be able to run most linux apps so it should be easy to
port lots of programs with a recompile. maybe kmail and Abiword
maybe wine (then you could run most windows apps NT,98,dos)

I guess porting things like “wine” or “dosemu” could be non trivial,
too much low level stuff.

Abiword has been ported to QRTP.

12

“David Heinrich” <dh003i@mail.rochester.edu> wrote in message
news:Pine.SGI.4.10.10007171535010.8939394-100000@mail1.ats.rochester.edu…

Under QNX there is no SWAP file ( I assume that’s what you mean my cache
file on
a separate partion)

No SWAP file?? What happens if one runs out of RAM? How does the OS deal
with the lack of adequate RAM?? I’ve always thought that it was standard
policy, and good for performance, to have a fixed SWAP file that’s at
least twice or thrice the size of one’s RAM.

QNX4 has no swap file, never has and never will. You have to understand
that QNX4 is a real-time operating system first and that SWAP real-time
don’t mix real well!!! On QNX4 a system with 64Megs of ram is plenty
to do development and browse the web at the same time…


QRTP it’s on it’s way and will probably fit your bill better then QNX4
What is the difference between QNX4 OS, Photon OS, and QRTP? Different
versions of the same base product, more advanced versions(i.e., as in
Win3.1, Win95, Win98, Win2000, WinME)

QNX4 is a command line base real-time OS.
Neutrino is the next generation OS, it’s meant to replace QNX4
at some point in time. It’s not an update it’s a new OS, redesign
from scratch.

Photon is not an OS it’s a GUI. It’s available for both QNX4
and Neutrino.

QRTP is Neutrino + Photon in one package, with more extra of course!

QRTP is the future. That were all new technology are implement
(such as the ability to run Linux Binaries).

If you look for a car that feels like a BMW but that sounds like a
Ferrari,
you won’t find it <snip
Well, maybe…there are Porsches, which have the power of a Ferarri and
the inside Luxery(at least 4 2 ppl) of a BMW…but I get your point –
always a compromise.

Put a 4 ppl porches will never have the handling of a Ferarri :wink:

snip

13

" The QNX Realtime Platform installs a 64MB swapfile when the OS is
installed, providing there is enough room on the partition to which it is
installed. If there was, the message “enabling swap file” will be
present upon booting the system. For an application to use the swap
space, the OS needs to be told that the pages can be swapped. This is
done with the call “munlockall()”. The tool ‘swapctl’ is used to monitor
the state (get stats, etc) of the swapfile. "
http://support.qnx.com/support/bok/solution.qnx?9390

I don’t quite understand…this contradicts what you’ve told me about the
swap and what I’ve read @ slashdot . . . is this a special option?


David J. Heinrich
dh003i@mail.rochester.edu
dh003i@yahoo.com
heinrich@rochester.rr.com

“If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stomping on a human face
– forever.” – Orwell, 1984

14

Then, on another page under the same support website it says:

" No. There are no plans for implementing one in QNX4. The main reason
for this is that reasons for requiring realtime response/performancs
typically conflict with the reasons for requiring a swap file.

The requirement for swapping in most QNX4 applications is quite low. The
efficiency of the OS and Watcom compiler provide relatively
small processes in terms of memory requirements. When this is combined
with the ability to share code between multiple process invocations and
shared libraries, the memory demands for QNX are quite moderate. "

It’s very confusing, b/c they contradict themselves.

On Tue, 18 Jul 2000, David Heinrich wrote:

" The QNX Realtime Platform installs a 64MB swapfile when the OS is
installed, providing there is enough room on the partition to which it is
installed. If there was, the message “enabling swap file” will be
present upon booting the system. For an application to use the swap
space, the OS needs to be told that the pages can be swapped. This is
done with the call “munlockall()”. The tool ‘swapctl’ is used to monitor
the state (get stats, etc) of the swapfile. "
http://support.qnx.com/support/bok/solution.qnx?9390

I don’t quite understand…this contradicts what you’ve told me about the
swap and what I’ve read @ slashdot . . . is this a special option?


David J. Heinrich
dh003i@mail.rochester.edu
dh003i@yahoo.com
heinrich@rochester.rr.com

“If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stomping on a human face
– forever.” – Orwell, 1984
\

15

Hi David,

No, they do not cantradict themselves (although it does appear that way on
first glance)
First, and foremost, do not confuse QNX4 (which they state will never have
SWAP) with
the QNX Realtime Platform (which does and will support SWAP).
QNX RTP (short for Realtime Platform) is the newest OS from QNX, and it
really shines!
This is the OS that they are promoting as a “Platform OS”. i.e. suitable
for the desktop if so required.
QNX4 was and is a great OS, but is the “previous generation”, and is
primarily for realtime applications only.

BTW I have used QNX4 extensively, and very rarely ran into any kind of
memory problems even without SWAP.

Regards,


David Heinrich <dh003i@mail.rochester.edu> wrote in message
news:Pine.SGI.4.10.10007180836140.8920830-100000@mail1.ats.rochester.edu…

Then, on another page under the same support website it says:

" No. There are no plans for implementing one in QNX4. The main reason
for this is that reasons for requiring realtime response/performancs
typically conflict with the reasons for requiring a swap file.

The requirement for swapping in most QNX4 applications is quite low. The
efficiency of the OS and Watcom compiler provide relatively
small processes in terms of memory requirements. When this is combined
with the ability to share code between multiple process invocations and
shared libraries, the memory demands for QNX are quite moderate. "

It’s very confusing, b/c they contradict themselves.

On Tue, 18 Jul 2000, David Heinrich wrote:

" The QNX Realtime Platform installs a 64MB swapfile when the OS is
installed, providing there is enough room on the partition to which it
is
installed. If there was, the message “enabling swap file” will be
present upon booting the system. For an application to use the swap
space, the OS needs to be told that the pages can be swapped. This is
done with the call “munlockall()”. The tool ‘swapctl’ is used to
monitor
the state (get stats, etc) of the swapfile. "
http://support.qnx.com/support/bok/solution.qnx?9390

I don’t quite understand…this contradicts what you’ve told me about
the
swap and what I’ve read @ slashdot . . . is this a special option?


David J. Heinrich
dh003i@mail.rochester.edu
dh003i@yahoo.com
heinrich@rochester.rr.com

“If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stomping on a
human face
– forever.” – Orwell, 1984

\

16

“Steve Munnings, Corman Technologies” <steve@cormantech.com> wrote in
message news:8l1lsj$5s$1@inn.qnx.com…

Hi David,

No, they do not cantradict themselves (although it does appear that way on
first glance)
First, and foremost, do not confuse QNX4 (which they state will never have
SWAP) with
the QNX Realtime Platform (which does and will support SWAP).
QNX RTP (short for Realtime Platform) is the newest OS from QNX, and it
really shines!

And has I explain in my previous post, QRTP is based on Neutrino.

This is the OS that they are promoting as a “Platform OS”. i.e. suitable
for the desktop if so required.
QNX4 was and is a great OS, but is the “previous generation”, and is
primarily for realtime applications only.

BTW I have used QNX4 extensively, and very rarely ran into any kind of
memory problems even without SWAP.

At the place I used to work they have one machine that has 64Mb of ram
and it’s used by 5 developer that a using it through phindows…

FYI phindows is a graphical terminal that runs on Windows. So basicly
everything run/display through phindows is RUN on the server.
And for 5 peoples, 64Megs is enough for development.

QRTP has a swap file mainly for one reason: to support GCC…
GCC consumes lots and lots of memory, some project wouldn’t
compile with 64Meg ;-(


Regards,


David Heinrich <> dh003i@mail.rochester.edu> > wrote in message

news:> Pine.SGI.4.10.10007180836140.8920830-100000@mail1.ats.rochester.edu> …
Then, on another page under the same support website it says:

" No. There are no plans for implementing one in QNX4. The main reason
for this is that reasons for requiring realtime response/performancs
typically conflict with the reasons for requiring a swap file.

The requirement for swapping in most QNX4 applications is quite low.
The
efficiency of the OS and Watcom compiler provide relatively
small processes in terms of memory requirements. When this is combined
with the ability to share code between multiple process invocations and
shared libraries, the memory demands for QNX are quite moderate. "

It’s very confusing, b/c they contradict themselves.

On Tue, 18 Jul 2000, David Heinrich wrote:

" The QNX Realtime Platform installs a 64MB swapfile when the OS is
installed, providing there is enough room on the partition to which it
is
installed. If there was, the message “enabling swap file” will be
present upon booting the system. For an application to use the swap
space, the OS needs to be told that the pages can be swapped. This is
done with the call “munlockall()”. The tool ‘swapctl’ is used to
monitor
the state (get stats, etc) of the swapfile. "
http://support.qnx.com/support/bok/solution.qnx?9390

I don’t quite understand…this contradicts what you’ve told me about
the
swap and what I’ve read @ slashdot . . . is this a special option?


David J. Heinrich
dh003i@mail.rochester.edu
dh003i@yahoo.com
heinrich@rochester.rr.com

“If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stomping on a
human face
– forever.” – Orwell, 1984



\

17

Ok, so QNX 4.0 is the OS by QNX for industrial jobs like lowering nuclear
reactors with millisecond presicision, and QNX RTP is a system that is
ready for and usable as a desktop OS to get normal-duty work done. Is QNT
RTP the same as QRTP and Neutrino RTOS??

On Tue, 18 Jul 2000, Steve Munnings, Corman Technologies wrote:

Hi David,

No, they do not cantradict themselves (although it does appear that way on
first glance)
First, and foremost, do not confuse QNX4 (which they state will never have
SWAP) with
the QNX Realtime Platform (which does and will support SWAP).
QNX RTP (short for Realtime Platform) is the newest OS from QNX, and it
really shines!
This is the OS that they are promoting as a “Platform OS”. i.e. suitable
for the desktop if so required.
QNX4 was and is a great OS, but is the “previous generation”, and is
primarily for realtime applications only.

BTW I have used QNX4 extensively, and very rarely ran into any kind of
memory problems even without SWAP.

Regards,


David Heinrich <> dh003i@mail.rochester.edu> > wrote in message
news:> Pine.SGI.4.10.10007180836140.8920830-100000@mail1.ats.rochester.edu> …
Then, on another page under the same support website it says:

" No. There are no plans for implementing one in QNX4. The main reason
for this is that reasons for requiring realtime response/performancs
typically conflict with the reasons for requiring a swap file.

The requirement for swapping in most QNX4 applications is quite low. The
efficiency of the OS and Watcom compiler provide relatively
small processes in terms of memory requirements. When this is combined
with the ability to share code between multiple process invocations and
shared libraries, the memory demands for QNX are quite moderate. "

It’s very confusing, b/c they contradict themselves.

On Tue, 18 Jul 2000, David Heinrich wrote:

" The QNX Realtime Platform installs a 64MB swapfile when the OS is
installed, providing there is enough room on the partition to which it
is
installed. If there was, the message “enabling swap file” will be
present upon booting the system. For an application to use the swap
space, the OS needs to be told that the pages can be swapped. This is
done with the call “munlockall()”. The tool ‘swapctl’ is used to
monitor
the state (get stats, etc) of the swapfile. "
http://support.qnx.com/support/bok/solution.qnx?9390

I don’t quite understand…this contradicts what you’ve told me about
the
swap and what I’ve read @ slashdot . . . is this a special option?


David J. Heinrich
dh003i@mail.rochester.edu
dh003i@yahoo.com
heinrich@rochester.rr.com

“If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stomping on a
human face
– forever.” – Orwell, 1984





\

18

David Heinrich wrote:

Ok, so QNX 4.0 is the OS by QNX for industrial jobs like lowering nuclear
reactors with millisecond presicision, and QNX RTP is a system that is
ready for and usable as a desktop OS to get normal-duty work done. Is QNT
RTP the same as QRTP and Neutrino RTOS??

Not quite. RtP is also hard real-time (that’s what the Rt, in RtP stands for).
Swap and real-time are not necessarily mutually exclusive, but you (the
designer) must be very carefull when using a RTOS with swap, since you must
explicitly lock-down every process in memory that can affect the response of
your application. I believe that RtP has the option to disable swap (which is
generally easier than trying to analyze every possible execution path of your RT
application). I’m not sure if RtP even allows you to lock down system processes
that are critical to your execution path (does anyone know the answer to this
?).

Neutrino (NTO) is the base O/S of RtP. RtP is the combination of NTO and the
Photon GUI, and a bunch of extra stuff to make it full featured development
environment (at least this is my understanding).

–
To succeed in this world it is not enough to be stupid; you must also be
well-mannered. - Voltaire

19

Previously, David Heinrich wrote in comp.os.qnx:

Then, on another page under the same support website it says:

" No. There are no plans for implementing one in QNX4. The main reason
for this is that reasons for requiring realtime response/performancs
typically conflict with the reasons for requiring a swap file.

The requirement for swapping in most QNX4 applications is quite low. The
efficiency of the OS and Watcom compiler provide relatively
small processes in terms of memory requirements. When this is combined
with the ability to share code between multiple process invocations and
shared libraries, the memory demands for QNX are quite moderate. "

It’s very confusing, b/c they contradict themselves.

I’m not sure whether swapping has been implemented yet in Neutrino, since
I’ve never tried to turn it on, I have 64MB and a lean o/s. However, the
intention, I believe, is that applications that want to be swappable can
be so, but the default is unswappable, in contrast to other o/s which
are the reverse. Maybe I’ll give it a shot tonight and see how it works.

And, BTW, they do not contradict themselves. The QNX realtime platform
is based on QNX6, also called Neutrino, NOT QNX4. Maybe a little confusing
though…

Sam

On Tue, 18 Jul 2000, David Heinrich wrote:

" The QNX Realtime Platform installs a 64MB swapfile when the OS is
installed, providing there is enough room on the partition to which it is
installed. If there was, the message “enabling swap file” will be
present upon booting the system. For an application to use the swap
space, the OS needs to be told that the pages can be swapped. This is
done with the call “munlockall()”. The tool ‘swapctl’ is used to monitor
the state (get stats, etc) of the swapfile. "
http://support.qnx.com/support/bok/solution.qnx?9390

I don’t quite understand…this contradicts what you’ve told me about the
swap and what I’ve read @ slashdot . . . is this a special option?



David J. Heinrich
dh003i@mail.rochester.edu
dh003i@yahoo.com
heinrich@rochester.rr.com

“If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stomping on a human face
– forever.” – Orwell, 1984



\

–
Sam Roberts (sam@cogent.ca), Cogent Real-Time Systems (www.cogent.ca)
“News is very popular among its readers.” - RFC 977 (NNTP)

20

And, BTW, they do not contradict themselves. The QNX realtime platform
is based on QNX6, also called Neutrino, NOT QNX4. Maybe a little confusing
though…

QSSL doesn’t wants us to call it QNX6. The only place were this is mention
is in uname. Confusing enough!

To add to your confusion David :wink: QRTP is based on Photon 2.0.
QNX4 can only run Photon 1.14.

QRTP is still early beta, as is Photon 2.0 that uses it.
At the moment you can buy an official release of QNX4
and Neutrino 2.0 and Photon 1.14, ouf!



Sam

On Tue, 18 Jul 2000, David Heinrich wrote:

" The QNX Realtime Platform installs a 64MB swapfile when the OS is
installed, providing there is enough room on the partition to which it
is
installed. If there was, the message “enabling swap file” will be
present upon booting the system. For an application to use the swap
space, the OS needs to be told that the pages can be swapped. This is
done with the call “munlockall()”. The tool ‘swapctl’ is used to
monitor
the state (get stats, etc) of the swapfile. "
http://support.qnx.com/support/bok/solution.qnx?9390

I don’t quite understand…this contradicts what you’ve told me about
the
swap and what I’ve read @ slashdot . . . is this a special option?



David J. Heinrich
dh003i@mail.rochester.edu
dh003i@yahoo.com
heinrich@rochester.rr.com

“If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stomping on a
human face
– forever.” – Orwell, 1984






\

Sam Roberts (> sam@cogent.ca> ), Cogent Real-Time Systems (> www.cogent.ca> )
“News is very popular among its readers.” - RFC 977 (NNTP)